Sun, Nov 22, 2009
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Name:
MsBlake
Comment: Like I've said before I love Tavis, I believe he has good intentions but I still feel he was taking the Obama invite a little too personal. As for the folks sending death theats to him and harassing his family, that is totally ridculous and uncalled for. That is taking it to a whole different level. Even Obama wouldn't approve of that foolishness. I wish these folks would re-direct their anger elsewhere, like at the government who are pretty slow to help folks affected by Katrina. As for Aretha Franklin? well u said it, so damn petty.
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Name:
TGen
Comment: The last part of this article was cute, but the first part has holes. First, a lot of latecomers think the Tavis/Obama ordeal stemmed from Obama's declining the invite to the SOTBU gathering. Not so. Research it. People sensed the stench from Tavis' tilted commentaries on Obama LONG before he even brought up the SOTBU thing. Tavis' first [unfounded] "issue" with BO was BO's supposed lack of talking about the issues affecting Black folks. When BO responded with specific issues, Tavis got on the SOTBU rant (and I guess decided to pull MoKelly with him lol). So to claim this is all about the SOBTU is downright disingenuous. On the sick-os giving Smiley death threats, newsflash MoKelly, "crazy" is NOT exclusive to Black folks. Whites and others do the death threat-over- stupid-ish-thing ALL THE TIME. Why make it a Black thing, except maybe you couldn't think of another topic to write on or something? lol I digress
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Name:
xavixavi
Comment: The Queen bit was a bit petty, but put yourself in Re's shoes. They just put her on a diet (oops lifestyle change), and she was just a little too agitated. She has been called "Queen of Soul" since the 60's, and Tina only got her's after her resurgence in the 80's. Yes they could have been a bit more specific. Yes I thought it was goin to be some weird TRIO when Bey only said Queen, but she should have gotten over it. I also believe Mathews response was just as uncalled for. I always say that it's just better to say NOTHING!
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Name:
xavixavi
Comment: For those of you NOT watching the political landscape properly, here is a news flash for ya! Barack has not been very substantive on ANY real issue black or white. It is a criticism he is getting from many people. THIS is NOT to say that I don't like him, it is just to point out a fact! He has actually said to an interviewer recently (I think it was George Stephanopolus) that if people want to know specifics they can go on his website and look it up. I LIKE the man, but that came off as very arrogant to me. It has been said that people respond more to platitudes than specifics and Barack is proving this true. This was a thought out strategy, and it has been working. The american electorate, black and white, is thought of as uneducated with the attention span of a dust mite. They feel that if you WASTE too much time going into specifics, you lose people. That being said I want him to win, and winning requires that you answer your opponents not w/ more platitudes, but with specifics in your speaches. That being said, before you comment, I ask that you do 3 things! One, listen to what Tavis really said, there is a link to it in a previous Eurweb article. Two, listen to a FULL B.O. speech/interview -- not just the snippets they give you on the news. Three, go to his website and look up his views on issues. The above may make you like him more/less, it doesn't matter. It does make you informed. On the issues, he and Hillary are almost totally the same. It's just their approach. On the Black issue thing, SHE has actually said MORE than he has. The reason she is doing so is to court our vote. The reason he is NOT doing so, is that he is trying to sound more like a candidate of all people and not a black candidate. That is how you win! You can't just win on the black vote, so you have to appeal to all. He INTENTIONALLY waited on the Jenna issue because of this. I'm not saying anything against him. I'm saying that he is being practical, and to call yourself aware, you should look into both sides of an argument -- not just go with a knee jerk reaction. Many Black "activists" always have issue with black candidates b/c they feel that they stray too far from the black community to try to win white votes. Sometimes this ends up being true, and we become disappointed in our leaders. They try so hard to please all people that they please no one -- Dinkins in NY comes to mind. I for one am willing to give Barack the benefit of the doubt -- just like we would any white candidate. I'm just doing it w/ blinders off! I'm not supporting him b/c of his cumbayah (sp) approach. I personally don't believe it works, and I'm hoping that that is just the campaing talkin. My hope is that he'll not waste too much time trying, and will get down to the dirty when he needs to. He has shown some ability to do that... Just look at his lack of votes.....
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Name:
MorrisOKelly
Comment: Like I said...I'm going to leave the Tavis thing alone...for now. But Xavi...how perceptive you are.
And I too am an Obama supporter.
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Name:
TGen
Comment: Xavixavi, sorry, no dice. In the same breath you say he is soft on issues, you say he and Hillary have the SAME issues! lol What gives? Also, you're wrong on the Jena thing. Michael Baisden can vouch that BO submitted a statement on Jena when it FIRST came to national attention, b4 a lot of folks jumped on that bandwagon. Your facts are just flat out wrong on that. Also you seem to contradict yourself, in one breath saying you understand his "kumbaya" approach saying "that is who you WIN!" And in the next breath you say, "I don't think it works." Again what gives? Bottom line, Barack is not a perfect candidate imo. I don't think he has a lot of experience (neither does Hillary for that matter) or the stellar track record that experience could provide, but to criticize his "kumbaya" approach is off-base. That is in fact his biggest AZZET, not a weakness. Jmo
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Name:
MsBlake
Comment: Co-sign TGen. I agree the Tavis drama started before the SOTBU issue. Tavis like several other black folks in the public eye are passionate about black issues and just want us to be informed but unlike others Tavis' delivery (in my opinion) just came across as a tad bit harsh/angry hence the backlash!! He is probably a pretty cool dude who gets heated sometimes and we are taking it the wrong way. There is a vast amount of information out there about the candidates and their policies, one can easily find that out without relying on speeches for specifics. Instead of focusing on the dems all the time folks should also be focussing on Mccain who could end up winning as a result of the drama with the superdelegates. I have noticed a similar pattern with Republicans, they tend to decline alot of events and interviews that are related to black folks. They even turned down a chance to discuss their stance on black issues with Ebony magazine recently. Makes u wonder huh?
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Name:
MorrisOKelly
Comment: Home run Ms. Blake, home run...how perceptive you are.
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Name:
BigMamaThang
Comment: For those of you looking for specifics, visit www.barackobama.com. His positions and policies are laided out for all to review and form opinions on. You can easily find his voting records for the US Senate and the Illinois Senate. He's also released a lot of personal information about himself through two books as well as sharing his tax records. Obama has been one of the most transparent candidates I've seen in a long time. When it comes to Tavis, his commentaries have been coming off as anti-Obama for months. Whether or not that was his real intent doesn't matter at this point because it's obvious that his message has been lost because the perception is that he's anti-Obama. The fact that Obama isn't going to SOTBU is a non-issue to me. Obama has been very clear about where he stands on issues that affect Black Americans. He's worked at various levels of govenment on issues such as racial profiling, manadotory minimums, unemployment, community organizing, etc. I respect any candidate's decision to skip this event because clearly the road to the White House has not been as easy as anyone expected and the timing is just unfortunate. It disingenuous to paint not attending as not caring about Black America. Republicans who have contiously skipped every opportunity to court the Black vote should be scrutinized more closely. I know a lot of Black folk who believe in the values that the Republican party espouses. We all should be more up in arms over that.
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Name:
MsBlake
Comment: Co-sign bigmamathang. I think alot of black folks feel the republicans don't care about us so whats the point. The problem with that is Republicans are slipping through the cracks and may rise up and snatch the nomination. My brother in law is in Iraq and his pregnant wife cries herself to sleep almost everyday. She's not overly impressed with a candidate who plans to keep folks in Iraq for another hundred years and refuses to discuss issues affecting the black community. Hopefully folks threatening Tavis' life and family need to quit the foolishness and focus, cos u never know come November...........I'm just sayin!!
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Name:
DOne
Comment: I agree with TGen. I noticed the tone of Tavis's commentaries way before the SOTBU issue arose. It wasn't what he was saying, but the tone. You could tell that he was biased towards Clinton. I've gone to both Clinton and Obama's websites and looked at their voting records, and what bills they have sponsored and yes they are pretty much the same on the issues. Both have sponsored and supported bills that would positively impact the black community. I think the difference is that some black people expect Obama to be a black leader, which he is not. The same people don't expect the same of Hillary. What we have to understand, that if Obama or any other black person that may eventually make it to the white house, they will not be a black president, they will be a president who happens to be black and anyone who fails to see the difference will be disappointed. If president, Obama will not place black issues on the front burner, but neither will Hillary. However, both are speaking to issues to affect blacks, again there's a difference in black issues and issues that affect blacks. Travis wants Obama to speck directly to black issues while not asking the same of Hillary. BTW, giving a speech to a black audience isn't the same as speaking directly to our issues.
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Name:
My2Pennies
Comment: Thanks for this article Mo. We needed 1 more Double Jeopardy question/answer for a Black History Jeopardy game that's happening today at my job....lol
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Name:
xavixavi
Comment: Tgen, reread what I wrote. If I wasn't making it clear, I'm sorry, but what I was referring to is thier speeches! When most of the other candidates go out, they issue many policy specific speeches -- usually geared toward a specific audience. Obamas speeches have been very short on specifics. He is winning because it's very hard to fight ideals and specifics. Hilary is trying to play to her strenghts which truly is more experience. She has him there, and he knows it! Thats why they don't go to specifics. Barack has a certain arrogance that kinda says go look it up. When Jenna first begam, and Obama wasn't likely to become the nominee, he made comments. When it started to really come into the forefront of the NATION's mind, rather than further affirm, he referred to his previous comments. That's slick!!! It doesn't give Hil et all the soundbite to say that he is a black people's candidate, but it kinda sorta get's the point here. TGen you are caling me contradictory b/c I don't believe you understand nuance. Kinda I love ya, but I don't like some of the things you do. The Kumbaya approach will work in getting him elected, but I don't see it making the grade once he is in office. That is what I meant. Hence the seeming contradiction. I already wrote and epistle, and figured you would make the leaps. IMO I'm honest about why I'm supporting him. HE IS BLACK, AFRICAN AMERICAN, i.e. we share an abundance of melanin. If you really believe Kumbaya will work when he gets into office, I got news for you, it will only get him but so far. It is/has been a game for over 200 years. Call me cynical, but to think one man can make more than a superficial dent in that system is unrealistic.
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Name:
xavixavi
Comment: Furthermore, the Hil was for the war and I wasn't doesn't cut it w/ me either. It's nice to say what you would do w/ a million dollars if you had it, but you can't really say what you would do w/ it till you get it. Hill and all the other democrats were plain full of b.s. when they said they thought Iraq had w.m.d's. The cold hard fact it that 90% of th U.S. was %*$!ed at 9/11 and we as a country wanted to make some one pay -- even if that someone didn't have anything to do w/ bombing the WTC. Saddam just wasn't sorry it happened! Bush & Co made it so that spineless dems had to vote for it, or risk losing elections. If no Americans were dying in Iraq, Bush's approval rating would not be in the dumps, and we would have another Republican in office. I personally agree w/ Charlie Rangel when he says we should bring back the draft. Only we should remove a lot of loop holes that get rich kids out of it. When we ALL have an equal opportunity to die, we will be more careful as to what wars we engage in.
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Name:
xavixavi
Comment: BigMamaThang the issue here is that thought the Internet is there for most of us, and we've all been on it for years, there is still a significant portion of the voting population that doesn't know squat about it. All they know is it's that youtube thing my kids play with. For years people have relied on the candidate's speeches to know what they would do on specific issues. This is another reason why I believe Obama is not getting the older demographic as much as he should. Older people want to know what you gonna do for me, and they can wade through b.s., and pretty language much quicker.
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Name:
amethyst
Comment: xavi - I liked Rangel's idea of the draft when he said it, too. After watching Michael Moore's 9-11 and learning that only one member of Congress had a child in Iraq, I understood Rangel's point. Legislators are like the managers and executives at our jobs - they make decisions while others do the hard work and make the sacrifices. I agree with you that no candidate (and no human being) is perfect, and I don't think I agree 100% with any of my loved ones. That's just reality. I really liked Bill Clinton as President, but I disagreed with certain things he did. After I did my research and listened to the debates, Obama best represents my interests and approaches. I'm supporting him, but I don't expect to agree with everything he has done and will do. BTW - Please tell Hillary I've seen enough debates.
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Name:
BigMamaThang
Comment: xavixavi - I hear you. Please answer me one question. What has Hillary done since she has been in office? What laws has she authored or co-sponsored since she was elected to the Senate? She's run her campaign based on her experience. What has she done? What can she point to that shows she reached across the aisle to work with Republicans in in Congress to work on legislation that affects all Americans? Obama has already done it and he's only been in the US Senate since 2005. Do I agree that Obama needs to get more specific in his speeches? Yes I do. You are right to point out that there are large numbers of Americans that do not have internet access. If he wants to win OH, PA & TX he's going to have to speak more directly to 'bread & butter' issues. I believe whole heartedly that if he successfully tweaks his message he'll either win those states or it will be very close.
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Name:
xavixavi
Comment: methyst I liked Bill on the surface too, and probaably still do like him. Here's a news flash for ya though... Bush actually appointed more blacks and browns to his staff than Clinton ever did. As for those debates. If you think Hilary's going to give them up, I got a bridge to sell ya. Barack is raising more money than her by a LONG shot. She needs the debates for free advertisement. The winner/money maker always wants less debates. The loser or one w/out money always wants more debates. Plus she believes that she wins the debates -- bad mistake.
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Name:
Olivia
Comment: I agree with the Tavis part. I think either people don't know or don’t care, but Tavis invited him last year and he called the night before and said he was NOT coming….but announced his candidacy on the SAME DAY & TIME as the SOBU. As for Aretha, people often concentrate on the “Queen” comment, but I argue it was not what got Aretha feathers ruffled. I think after naming all our black great singers when Beyonce said: “There is ONE legend who has the essence of all of those things: the glamour, the soul, the passion, the strength, the talent”. In essence Ella, Aretha, Gladys, Anita, Whitney ect…did not have ALL the elements….’There is ONE” who does, I think anyone named could have taken offense. People just don't know how to honor folks in their own right anymore ......to me was a bad choice of words. I think you don’t honor people by saying what others may have “lacked”. Just the way I see it.
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Name:
xavixavi
Comment: BigMamaThang, I was going to comply, but then I think you need to before I do. The answer is they are really about equal. Voting record and such. Please don't buy into that "I introduced" rhetoric on EITHER of them. Sponsorship they are equal. Co-sponsorship is bs. What co-sponsorship means is that they go to some senator that actually did most of the leg-work and asked to be placed on the bill. They both have done that. Look at the record at http://www.senate.gov/pagelayout/legislative/a_three_s ections_with_teasers/votes.htm .. This is real. Do not look at either of their websites. Then go hunt for the votes.
In actuality, they both have been working w/ republicans. Hillary travels w/ McCain and other more liberal republicans. They have to work together behind the scenes.
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Name:
xavixavi
Comment: My reasons for voting for oback: HE IS black, people hate him less than Hilary, and HE IS BLACK. My reasons for not voting for Hilary. She felt she deserved the nomination, and didn't really have to work for it that hard. Essentially folks a democrat would have to work really hard to lose this election. The time is ripe for democrats. Hilary saw this, and just decided that she deserved the presidency. This has always been her plan. Because of this, her votes have been carefully crafted to make sure she doesn't lose the prize. Barack came in doing the same thing, but w/ less baggage.
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Name:
xavixavi
Comment: mo yo sho have been quiet while watching us argue:)
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Name:
mayday
Comment: xavixavi........you are on point on all of your posts, keep dropping the FACTS. I miss the boards, new job, and IT monitors our internet use...later.
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Name:
6footah
Comment: Another component of being Queen or King is having subjects. It appears as though Aretha has eaten all of hers, Bobby has snorted his, Steve Harvey used his as double-sided tape on the underside of that toupee he recently got rid of (God does answer prayer!), Michael Jackson's have disappeared along with his skin's pigment and Teddy Riley sold his on Ebay for spending change.
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Name:
queeniebunz
Comment: >6footah - LOL! You ain't right!... as for the whole Tavis thing, well, I like what the governor of Massachusetts did when pitted against Obama. Instead of taking the opportunity to show yet more division in the black community, he sided with Obama and squashed the whole plagiarism thing before it grew into something ugly. Well done! I think Tavis and any other blacks should shut up and back Obama. They just should. Any disagreement should be brought to him privately and settled in a back room out of sight of "the other culture". Why? Because one of the reasons we as black folk are not taken seriously in this country as a people is because we lack solidarity. We need to stand together publicly and handle/resolve any beefs quietly. We have to support our candidate. We just do. He's a fantastic representative of our people AND of ALL America people and he actually has a chance to be the first black president. Any black "leaders" trying to stop that should be ashamed of themselves, really.
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Name:
MorrisOKelly
Comment: Queenie...why "should" Tavis (or anyone else) just "shut up and back Obama?"
I'm asking this AS AN OBAMA SUPPORTER.
We've fought tooth and nail for years to show Democrats specifically and America generally that we're not blind sheep who are monolithic in nature.
This is the first race in which there TRULY has been a choice, and you recommend that we just shut up and back Obama?
Because he's Black? Does that really paint the Black electorate in the most favorable and intellectual light.
I would argue it makes out to be the sheep that we've been accused of being.
The whole nomination process right now is doing what it's supposed to do, MAKING candidates earn African-American votes.
Now come the general election, both parties will unite and move forward accordingly, but in terms of the primary, I'd have to say that critical discussion (not to be confused with "criticism" there's a difference) is appreciated.
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Name:
MorrisOKelly
Comment: I also think it's a bit disingenuous to allege that those who don't support Obama automatically have some hidden agenda or harbor feelings of jealousy.
There are legitimate questions and concerns to be had in terms of whether the substance meets the style.
I personally think it does, but I can understand why it can be an issue in this campaign because for the most part, Obama has stayed away from too many specifics in the conversations about future policy domestically.
He has indicated he would surely bring the troops home, but in terms of healthcare and the like...not as definitive.
Those are legitimate points of debate to be had and deal-breakers for any knowledgeable voter.
Tavis' point (which you in effect eloquently point out) is to not be consumed with the prospect of the First Black President that we lose sight of the issues that we need ANY president to address irrespective of color.
It means asking the right questions and raising the right issues in the development of this Democratic platform that the eventual nominee MUST adopt to some degree if that person will continue to hold the African-American electorate come November.
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Name:
Calidee
Comment: >>>Great posts Xavi
You are right on point in my book.
>>Mo' Kelly
You got Queen Calidee cracking up.... Did you say Usher's husband Maneka?
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Name:
MorrisOKelly
Comment: As for Aretha...regardless of the exact wording of the introduction, it was petty to even go there.
True "class" wouldn't have been so petty. So in effect she just proved all of her detractors right.
Evidently Aretha didn't embody ALL of those attributes, otherwise she wouldn't have been so petty.
A smarter way would have been to jokingly quip? "I thought I was the Queen of Soul..." I better get back into the studio and let these youngins' know what's up!...or something playful.
Her point is made, but she doesn't come across trite. But instead, she went there and everybody knew she was serious.
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Name:
aubreyl
Comment: Could,nt read all the comments posted here today..and some were not really wortty of being read.However, as an outsider from Canada, I will add my views as to why all people should give Obama their support.
1. He is an International man who appeals to decent minded folk and who has lived in and among many cultural groups.
2. He is upfront and honest(as politicians go) and has opened his life and character to all who will take the time to read.Indeed, he is transparent.
3.He shows that he is capable of bringing all Americans together as a people and is not separatist in his beliefs. If he only dealt with *black* issues, he certainly would not have gotten this far.
Most importantly, he DID NOT support the attack on Iraq nor the surge in troops. That is and will always be a negative for H.C
$. He looks damn good, speaks eloquently and will put a new face on the U.S that could only improve its image abroad and make all Americans proud. GO OBAMA ! GO!
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Name:
queeniebunz
Comment: >MoKelly – I stand by what I said. It does not make you sheep to back your own. Historically we have wrecked ourselves by splintering off in the name of not backing someone because he/she is black. Historically we’ve had division that hindered us as a people and did not move us forward. Think about it. If B.T. Washington and WEB DuBois had worked together instead of bickering back and forth – how much could such powerful men have accomplished! And, had the men of that time period stood with the powerful black women like my hero Ida B Wells-Barnett instead of acting like she should go make babies and bake pies. She was a powerhouse and they treated her like crap. Think about Malcolm X who said HIMSELF in his autobiography that he regretted not working with MLK. HE said that, not me. So I say again that if the prominent blacks in this country in all areas - entertainment, politics, academia, the media, the business world - would stop pushing their own agendas and would work together – WOW. What could be accomplished could blow our minds! But no. There are so many different camps that it’s ridiculous. It's the definition of counterproductive! You don’t see Jewish folk fighting amongst themselves publicly. They settle it behind closed doors and present a united front to the world. The same can be said for Asians and Latinos. Not us. And here we have the best chance in history thus far, of having a black president - and a GOOD ONE. Not Jesse with the history of Anti-semitism (Remember Himey Town?) and the baby on the side. Not Al with the James Brown hair and the Tawanna Brawley fiasco. We have a candidate who can actually win! Anybody who wrecks that with any hint of division –I cannot articulate in words how angry that makes me!
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Name:
MorrisOKelly
Comment: Aubrey - Nowhere will you find anyone alleging that Obama should "only" deal with "Black" issues, that's something you've added into the discussion through assumption.
The reality is that there are issues that speak to African-Americans specifically and more pointedly.
As is true with immigration (Latinos) and union issues, etc.
To think that a candidate doesn't reach out to specific communities and segments is simply untrue.
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Name:
xavixavi
Comment: Finally Mo, what you were sleeping on your own board? :) anyways aubreyl It may seem that I'm only supporting Obama b/c he is black. The reason, however, is b/c he is just as good as Hilary. If you put their pluses and negatives togehter, they really are more or less equal. He can get advisors for what every lack of experience he has. The trick is to get the right advisors. I've already said that "I didn't support the war" is RHETORIC that resounds w/ people who don't seem to understand the truth. I will agree w/ you that MAYBE Hilary should have said it was a mistake like others have done, but that is a TACTIC- just like when she says that crap about only giving him the "power" to help him "negotiate". PURE CRAP. I honestly believe that MOST of those Senators knew the war was bull! Obama wasn't a Senator so his being pro/against was moot! Did he seriously lobby his senators to vote against? Did he urge his constiuents to write their senators?
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Name:
xavixavi
Comment: oops, I forgot something. in that previous post. Yt has been voting incompetent people in for years just b/c they were the same color as them. If we have 2 competent candidates on the same stage, why shouldn't the fact that one is black sway me in his favor. I'm not against Hilary, like many others. I believe she would make a good president or even a good VICE-president, if you get my drift. I am just pro Obama.
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Name:
xavixavi
Comment: and another thing. Why y'all keep callin ushers wife maneka. I crack up every time I hear it, but it is sooo dang wrong. I'm sorry I can't help laughing. My cousin actually thought that was her name after hearing Wendy Wiliams call her that for sooooooo long.
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Name:
MorrisOKelly
Comment: I called his HUSBAND Maneka...get it right. :)
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